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S J Birkill
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Posts: 602
The 'new' MV: hate it!
« : 01.08.04 at 13:19 »

I'm announcing the new MV to all members today. Please post your messages of disapproval as replies in this thread.
 
-- Steve Birkill, MV administrator
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JtJ
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Posts: 93
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #1: 03.08.04 at 21:29 »

Good Grief!
 
I don't particularly want to be a dissenting (Midnight) Voice (did you see what I did there?  Wink )
But....
 
Heavens....there's a rapidly growing number of threads isn't there?
Am I alone in (already) feeling I'm missing things?
 
And the threads have sub-threads too.  (I may not be using the right terms though)
 
Sometimes I forget where I am.
And forget where I just read that post I want to go back to.
 
Still PMA eh?
 
Do we have a policy of how many threads there will be (maximum)?
How do more experienced Board Users (than me) handle this situation?
 
Trying to be Logical Constructivist in Hertfordshire (perhaps failing)....
 
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Simon Reap
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Posts: 101
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #2: 05.08.04 at 23:18 »

on 03.08.04 at 21:29, JtJ wrote:
Heavens....there's a rapidly growing number of threads isn't there?
Am I alone in (already) feeling I'm missing things?

 
That was one of the benefits of the email system - the mail reader would show the unread items, and it would be easy to whizz through them, knowing that you hadn't missed any and that you hadn't been forced to reread old ones.
 
With the BB, threads with unread items are indeed marked, but is there a way to see the unread parts of those threads?  Since the system obviously knows when you last looked at each thread (so as to know that the thread has new items that *you* haven't read), is it possible to get it to jump directly to that item in the thread? I know that you can show the n most recent items, but if you want to follow a thread logically (one of the benefoits of a BB such as this), then you will have read several dispersed entries in the 'most recent list' and will then not know which ones you have read.  You'd also need to remember when you last read the forum, to know where in the n items you should start looking.
 
That said, having all of these posts in a single easily-accessible place is an improvement over having them stored only on a PC at home (not couting the zipped archives and weekly digests).  Also makes Stece's job *much* easier.
 
The main problem I have now is that I am an old UNIX hacker, a lover of the humble command line - I just don't do GUIs!
 
Simon
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JtJ
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Posts: 93
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #3: 20.08.04 at 21:23 »

Hi there!
 
Actually....Maybe I spoke too soon....
I'm getting used to it now.
 
And it's made us all more chatty too.
That's GOT to be good.
 
I withdraw my previous objection, may it please the Voices (and Chief Voice).
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number_63
Ex-Member

Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #4: 23.08.04 at 20:34 »

because
 
its new  
 
its different
 
I don't use/understand message boards
 
nobody else still does all the work for me
 
but most of all because I end up not using it,compared to absorbing easily the whole MV Digest
 
(NB irony intended on reasons 1,2 and 4 above)
 
NB2- Steve-you did ask....!
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S J Birkill
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Posts: 602
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #5: 23.08.04 at 20:56 »

Points all taken, and not much we can do about that I'm afraid. Except [3] :
 
on 23.08.04 at 20:34, number_63 wrote:
I don't use/understand message boards

-- I think that probably applies to most of us here. But we're learning!
 
Steve
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Jan
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Posts: 304
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #6: 24.08.04 at 16:41 »

on 23.08.04 at 20:34, number_63 wrote:

nobody else still does all the work for me
but most of all because I end up not using it,compared to absorbing easily the whole MV Digest

If you do a little work now you can make the whole thing nearly email based and stay away from those threads most of the time. Its not really entering into the spirit of the thing but never mind.
Go to :
http://www.peteatkin.com/cgi-bin/mv/YaBB.cgi?board=news;action=display;num=10915 53124
 
and
 
http://www.peteatkin.com/cgi-bin/mv/YaBB.cgi?board=news;action=display;num=10914 44599
 
at each of them select "Notify of replies"
That makes sure you get emails about the important things.
Then click on the line at the top of the first screen which says:
Hello number_63 you have 0 new messages
Click on preferences and select email notification again.
If you have any sort of online diary then if possible get it to send you an email once every week - if you're on the MV digest - saying:
Go to:  
http://www.peteatkin.com/cgi-bin/mv/YaBB.cgi?action=recentpostlist;display=500
 
Then go to the last post you read and look at each of them in turn working up the list to the top. This will give you that MV random element which is otherwise missing from the forum.
I'm sure you know all this already but I found I couldn't cope with all those read and unread things so I just ignore them now Smiley
Jan
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Cary
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Posts: 87
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #7: 24.08.04 at 19:26 »

on 24.08.04 at 16:41, Jan wrote:

 
Then go to the last post you read and look at each of them in turn working up the list to the top. This will give you that MV random element which is otherwise missing from the forum.
I'm sure you know all this already but I found I couldn't cope with all those read and unread things so I just ignore them now Smiley
Jan

Jan,
 
I've tried to do this and found I have to go back and forward between the top 500 and the next message I want to read. It takes ages for the page to load each time. Is there a better way of doing this? I couldn't see a 'next message' link.'Latest 10' with messages on a single page seems much easier - but only if there are only 10 messages since you last visited!
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S J Birkill
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Posts: 602
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #8: 24.08.04 at 20:25 »

on 24.08.04 at 19:26, Cary wrote:
I've tried to do this and found I have to go back and forward between the top 500 and the next message I want to read. It takes ages for the page to load each time.

Does your browser reload the 500 list every time? I find that if I use the 'back' button from reading a message, the index of 500 messages redisplays instantly. Is this one of these Opera/Mozilla vs IE things, I wonder...
 
Would you be happier if the 500 list were reduced to 100? (I bet some would prefer 1000!)  
-- Steve
 
[Later] Yes, Opera redisplays the list page from cache, MSIE reloads it from the Internet. And because it's a table, none of it is displayed until it's all downloaded. Most definitely the same issue that caused Secret Drinker (see "Aaarrrgghhh!" under Tech) to lose his message text when he went back to it, and also results in those carefully-completed form details on numerous Websites to reset to blank on trying to resume or modify a search. I wonder whether there's any way to force IE out of this deviant (no doubt M$ would say 'correct') behaviour... Snoopy? Anyone? Or just ditch IE for a better browser.
« Last Edit: 24.08.04 at 20:46 by S J Birkill » IP logged
Snoopy
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Posts: 44
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #9: 24.08.04 at 21:33 »

Theoretically, going to Tools -> Internet Options in IE, then clicking 'Settings' next to where it says 'Temporary Internet Files', and choosing 'Check for newer versions of pages every time you start IE' should resolve the issue.
 
I'll leave checking whether or not it does as an exercise to the reader. Wink
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Cary
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Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #10: 24.08.04 at 22:28 »

Sorry to be causing you another aaarrgh Steve. This may be a MSIE problem. Takes a lot longer to reload the list than to load the message! So long it seems to have stalled altogether at times - the messages themselves load quite quickly by comparison. Reducing the length of the list would possibly reduce this time, a bit but probably still slow at times. I'd still have liked to see a'next'/ 'previous' button so you could just scroll through the messages. I find the 'latest 10 posts' much easier to scroll through and pick out the messages I want to have a good look at. Could the number of latest messages be increased? I realise this could cause a problem with the speed the page loads if there are too many messages, but it does seem much quicker to scroll through the messages and pick out those you want a good look at. What's the most feasible? 100 would/should cover a full week but would this make the page too long? Would 25 work? That should cover a days post on most days.
 
Thanks Steve Smiley
 
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Cary
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Posts: 87
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #11: 24.08.04 at 22:34 »

on 24.08.04 at 21:33, Snoopy wrote:
Theoretically, going to Tools ->'Check for newer versions of pages every time you start IE' should resolve the issue.
 
I'll leave checking whether or not it does as an exercise to the reader. Wink

I'm afraid this reader already had that setting so I guess it's still another exercise in problem solving for the techie Sad
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Jan
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Posts: 304
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #12: 25.08.04 at 08:59 »

on 24.08.04 at 21:33, Snoopy wrote:
Theoretically, going to Tools -> Internet Options in IE, then clicking 'Settings' next to where it says 'Temporary Internet Files', and choosing 'Check for newer versions of pages every time you start IE' should resolve the issue.
 
I'll leave checking whether or not it does as an exercise to the reader. Wink

Mine is set to "Automatically" in MSIE, whatever that may mean, and I use the browser back button. (I have to admit I have a very fast internet connection (100Mb)  Embarassed )
Of course on a day like today when all the messages are in the same thread you can go to the oldest and then read down the rest of the thread once you're there.
If you have a good memory you can go through the list and spot the threads unfortunately that is not an option for me any more, I can't remember whether it ever was.
Jan
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S J Birkill
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Posts: 602
Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #13: 25.08.04 at 09:40 »

I've moved a lot of formatting code out of the 500 table, and disabled the author profile links. It should now load at least twice as fast. Any further follow-up on this in the Tech board, please -- SJB
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Ian Chippett
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Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #14: 25.08.04 at 16:32 »

I've moved a lot of formatting code out of the 500 table, and disabled the author profile links. It should now load at least twice as fast. Any further follow-up on this in the Tech board, please -- SJB  
 
Slight moderatorial problem here which Steve's posting raises. For example, I see on the Shrinks section that Pete is a Beach Boys fan (quite naturally being  a musician of great discernment). If I want to discuss this, do I address my posting to the Shrinks part or to the Music part ? Because if MVs follow one but not the other, they'll be mystified by the sudden appearance of the Thread From Elsewhere.  
 
Baffled in Pantin (France)
 
Ian C
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S J Birkill
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Re: The 'new' MV: hate it!
« Reply #15: 25.08.04 at 16:52 »

Hi Ian
 
I'd say that, if your follow-up concerns the effect of Pete's BBs influence specifically on the Shrinks' music, it should go under Shrinks, but if as I suspect it's more general than that then Music is the place for it. Start a new thread, call it say 'Beach Boys influence?', and if it needs an intro, say something like 'Over on the Shrinks board' or even 'In message <link> on the Shrinks board, <member> referred to Pete's fascination with the diminished minor 13th cadence in Brian Wilson's vocal harmony arrangements on...', or whatever.  
 
BTW if anyone feels the board categories are too narrow, or need augmenting (!) I'm open to suggestions. Of course, any new board will need a moderator! And so as not to prove the point before it's made, I think I'd class such a thread as a Technicality.
 
Steve
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